Talk:Seogwipo

Here we go again

But this time, take it from the top, boys! (WT-en) Ojousama 23:02, 8 January 2008 (EST)

Rename to Seogwipo

-Si just means "city" in Korean, we don't usually append this to article names about Korean locasions (Seoul, not Seoul-Si, etc.). I suggest moving this to Seogwipo. PS. And no, this is not the case of New York City, -Si is not an official part of the name here. Piotrus (talk) 04:47, 13 November 2022 (UTC)

Done. I'm not sure why this talk page didn't move, but an earlier incarnation of Seogwipo had its own talk page. Ikan Kekek (talk) 06:51, 22 November 2022 (UTC)

Any existing page at the target name (except redirects to the page you are moving, with no earlier history), needs to be explicitly deleted to allow the move. For the target page itself, you are asked whether to delete it, but for the accompanying page you need to delete it by hand (and if they have real content, as in this case, probably restored as part of the history). I'll do it now. –LPfi (talk) 11:12, 22 November 2022 (UTC)

Earlier history

The former Seogwipo article was apparently cut-and-paste copied into Seogwipo-si, which now is moved here to Seogwipo. As the history of the two overlapped, I moved the earlier history to Seogwipo/archive. I am not sure this was the most elegant solution, but interspersed history is ugly and confusing, and the old authors need to be attributed. –LPfi (talk) 11:35, 22 November 2022 (UTC)

(Diff between archived and current version) –LPfi (talk) 11:44, 22 November 2022 (UTC))

There may be an even better way of handling this; I'll drop you a talk page message with a suggestion. Piotrus (talk) 07:10, 24 November 2022 (UTC)

It would be possible, but I think this is safer. Thanks for adding the top box. –LPfi (talk) 11:39, 24 November 2022 (UTC)

Rename help

Swept in from the pub

I explained this at Talk:Seogwipo-Si last week, but nobody commented, and an admin is needed for the move. Since Wikivoyage doesn't use (or hides very well) categories, I don't know how to check if any other Korean locations need similar moving (the others I checked are ok, i.e. not using the "-si" suffix, which means "city"). Piotrus (talk) 05:29, 22 November 2022 (UTC)

It is renamed now. To view the categories you need to enable "Show hidden categories" (Appearance/Advanced options). Going straight to Category:South Korea and clicking your way through the hierarchy works regardless. Sejong City is found under that name, no "-Si"s that I could see in either Korea. –LPfi (talk) 14:05, 22 November 2022 (UTC)

@LPfi Thanks. Sejong City seems correct, this seems to be the case of "New York City". As well as Jeju City, I think. I didn't notice any other errors, so we are all good here, I think. Piotrus (talk) 07:07, 24 November 2022 (UTC)

Uh-oh, I spoke too soon (also ping @Ikan Kekek). So we discovered that Seogwipo and Seogwipo-Si were at some point separate (they have been merged now, good). I think I figured out a possible reason for this, and this is related to another problem: I think we likely need to merge Jeju City and Jeju-Si. The latter is an orphan (not connected to Wikipedia), that claims it is about "the northern district of Jeju island", but -Si means city in Korean (and so Jeju-Si redirects to Jeju City on en wiki and other projects). As far as I can tell from :wikipedia:Jeju_Province#Administrative_divisions the island has two cities, which cover half of the island each (see this map File:Jeju Municipal.svg). Jeju#Regions is a bit confusing, it talks about two cities/districts, a national park (which I think spans both city regions) and three tiny small islands (each treated as a separate region?) but which administratively are part of one or the other city district. Would appreciate thoughts from more experienced Wikivoyagers on what to clean up here, which includes both moving stuff and how to fix the region listing for the island.

After we deal with the merge, I'd appreciate thoughts on what should be moved from Jeju into its regional subarticles, so I can direct my students (I have a group working on this topic) correctly. PS. Remember the #Strange yellow layer?? I think it was showing the southern city/region. Not sure if it could be finished by adding the northern one, or should we use the map I linked, or...? Piotrus (talk) 07:23, 24 November 2022 (UTC)

We don't really care about administrative divisions, so handling the two cities (the districts, except the national park), the national park and the islands in separate articles is OK, and the way we usually handle things. We should probably check that we don't use wordings that suggest that we actually cover a specific administrative entity in any of those articles.

The problem here, Wikivoyage-wise, is that the island isn't properly regionalised. The listings should be moved from Jeju to the city, park and rural area articles (these are a new type, which some city articles could be transformed into, but there's no hurry in that) – and every part of the island should be covered by some non-region article. The countryside on the main island outside the two cities should either be handled in the city articles, making the two subregion articles (north and south) redundant, or new articles should be created for the countryside, perhaps two or three in each half of the island.

Dividing the island requires some local knowledge or detailed study. Ideally an article would cover an area where you would stay and visit different attractions. If you need to travel to the city to transfer, or you'd stay in the city and visit attractions all over, then having separate articles for the countryside makes less sense.

–LPfi (talk) 10:49, 24 November 2022 (UTC)