(WT-en) Tapirlodge

Hello Tapirlodge! Welcome to Wikivoyage.

To help get you started contributing, we've created a tips for new contributors page, full of helpful links about policies and guidelines and style, as well as some important information on copyleft and basic stuff like how to edit a page. If you need help, check out Project:Help, or post a message in the travellers' pub. Lemme know if you need some help. Keep smiling, (WT-en) edmontonenthusiast [ee] ^.T.A.L.K. 17:37, 20 November 2008 (EST).

Ecuador edits

Thanks for cleaning up the Ecuador article—it's an article very much in need of attention. --(WT-en) Peter ^Talk 18:31, 20 November 2008 (EST)

My pleasure I'm the web master of a tourist agency and I don't like publicity spam in wikis specially because I will use and contribute to this wiki.

--(WT-en) Tapirlodge 12:35, 21 November 2008 (EST)

One note, however, is that we actually WANT listings for restaurants and hotels in articles so that users know where they can stay (see Project:Accommodation listings and Project:Small city article template). Similarly, for a destination like the Galapagos Islands it is useful to have a list of companies offering tours. There's a fine line between a listing and spam, so it's perfectly OK to remove several paragraphs of promotional material when it gets added, but at the same time we want to make sure travelers are getting the information they need to plan a visit. -- (WT-en) Ryan • (talk) • 13:28, 21 November 2008 (EST)

Ok I note that--(WT-en) Tapirlodge 14:20, 21 November 2008 (EST)

I think it will take a time but with the correct open directories and a little of work I will do the work

I think it's better to refers to open directories instead of filling list of places, What it's your opinnion about this idea?--(WT-en) Tapirlodge 14:24, 21 November 2008 (EST)

The problem is that the list content the list of the tours it's (please correct me if I'm wrong) publicity and it won't be fair for all the tour operators if the list doesn't content all the travel operators.

Now that I'm aware of all this issues I will be more careful and I will try to follow the template--(WT-en) Tapirlodge 14:30, 21 November 2008 (EST)

Most of the policies in terms of what to list have been worked out over the past several years - listing a restaurant is OK, but listing a link to a restaurant review site is not. In the case of a place like the Galapagos Islands, listing a tour operator is OK as long as they actually operate the tour, but listing a company that simply sells passage on tours operated by others is not OK. Most of these guidelines can be found from Project:Manual of style. It is very difficult to keep spammers from ruining Wikivoyage articles, but at the same time we want to enable travelers and locals to recommend the best restaurants, hotels, bars, and other sights in a location. As to links to a site like Open Directory, the policy of the site is to try to create articles that are a complete guide to a location without the need to rely on outside sites - we link to Open Directory for more information, but try to make each article capable of standing on its own. -- (WT-en) Ryan • (talk) • 14:45, 21 November 2008 (EST)

Nice

Nice work on various articles, you seem to really know how things work around here despite being new. I think I am going to award you with a Barnstar which means "Good Job, Keep it up". ZOMG meteor on the prairies yesterday!!(WT-en) edmontonenthusiast [ee] ^.T.A.L.K. 12:35, 21 November 2008 (EST).

Thanks ^^ --(WT-en) Tapirlodge 12:38, 21 November 2008 (EST)

Good work so far recently. It is nice you still continue to contribute after the harshness of what has ben said. (WT-en) edmontonenthusiast [ee] ^.T.A.L.K. 12:00, 26 November 2008 (EST).

Comments about your edits

Stop removing restaurants and hotels. It's not "publicity", this is a travel guide, we're supposed to have listings of places to eat and sleep. Even travel agencies are OK as long as they follow the guidelines in Tour. I've reverted your edits. (WT-en) Jpatokal 01:12, 22 November 2008 (EST)

You know what, do not delete this. And don't get pissy just because someone noticed you did something wrong. Take it as it is and remember to do "Mucho" better next time. Keep Smiling, (WT-en) edmontonenthusiast [ee] ^.T.A.L.K. 16:32, 25 November 2008 (EST).

OK the next time won't take care of spam and only edit what I need--(WT-en) Tapirlodge 16:37, 25 November 2008 (EST)

What the hell is your problem buddy? We are not wanting you to stop getting rid of spam, but make sure it is spam. Also, if you believe it is spam, give a reason why under the summary so that we can see if the reason is legit and we can look into it. Keep Smiling, (WT-en) edmontonenthusiast [ee] ^.T.A.L.K. 16:43, 25 November 2008 (EST).

The way of saying was the problem, it's to much to ask for a please? "Stop removing restaurants and hotels." is and order, not and advice or and suggestion, that is my problem.--(WT-en) Tapirlodge 16:52, 25 November 2008 (EST)

Don't take it like that, we ARE supposed to have restaurant, hotel, and to an extent store listings. And we are supposed to give examples. The only time it is a problem when it appears on so many places and it isn't a corperate chain. So quit doing that. You need to read rules. Keep Smiling, (WT-en) edmontonenthusiast [ee] ^.T.A.L.K. 16:57, 25 November 2008 (EST).

I try to help but it seems you don't need help with that so I will only edit the articles I need for my work and let you fight with the spammers, People need advice not orders. And don't worry I wont delete anything else that don't affect the articles I need for my work--(WT-en) Tapirlodge 17:12, 25 November 2008 (EST) PD: check the numbers of edit I make in one day make numbers in days with some advise I can clean all the spam in Ecuador but I don't need this kind of treat in change of free help, so I will take care of my stuff, yo need to understand how to treat people "Take it as it is and remember to do "Mucho" better next time.", I don't need more of that.--(WT-en) Tapirlodge 17:30, 25 November 2008 (EST)

Okay seriously, I am going to refrain from responding to you otherwise I will go extremely nuts on you, so could LtPowers, Texugo, Jani, Peter, Stefan, Inas, Ryan, AHeenen, someone please respond to this! Keep Smiling, (WT-en) edmontonenthusiast [ee] ^.T.A.L.K. 17:37, 25 November 2008 (EST).

Sorry but it's not usual for my that people talk like "What the hell is is your problem" to me.--(WT-en) Tapirlodge 17:55, 25 November 2008 (EST)

Oh my gosh, I am sorry for saying that-I know it's harsh but you were starting to piss me off and I am sorry. Why? Because you aren't understanding how article's and their templates work. If it really is vandalism, why would pracitically every other article have specific restaurant/hotel listings? It isn't spamming, as long as they are good places, they should be added. Why don't you get that? We don't want you to stop that, we want to help you so you get it right! Keep Smiling, (WT-en) edmontonenthusiast [ee] ^.T.A.L.K. 18:00, 25 November 2008 (EST).

Hmm a bit confused by the reaction of everyone, went to a few of the edits in question, and while a few of the deletion might have been a bit out of order, The majority of them weren't - I've seen admin's removing listings for less. Anyway, for the record we prefer adding-info/rewording/de-touting of listings rather than plain deletion, which might be what confused you here. If you're unsure if removal of some listing is justified, it might be an idea to add a message to talk page, until you are familiar with the way stuff works here. Then I'll and hopefully some others will try to keep up with you.

One thing of note though, is that we do allow buiness owners to add their listings here, provided they don't tout. --(WT-en) Stefan (sertmann) ^Talk 17:58, 25 November 2008 (EST)

Ok np I will Follow all the rules--(WT-en) Tapirlodge 18:07, 25 November 2008 (EST)

I certainly wouldn't go nuts. So many hotel and tour entries verge on useless, because they are added by people with a vested interest, contain no information and simply cannot be trusted by a traveler. I certainly don't trust any accommodation listings on wikivoyage when I am traveling. I guess the skill is in de-touting, getting rid of information that just misleads, but still keeping and adding to the valuable parts of the information. Its always a tough call, and people are always going to have different views. No doubt (WT-en) Jpatokal's tone was inappropriate for a first communication. If in doubt, just discuss on the talk page first. --(WT-en) Inas 18:08, 25 November 2008 (EST)

See when I do it I cause a ruckus and then when Stefan Ertmann does it it's like all better! Argh...tell moi yur secret...ahah! Keep Smiling, (WT-en) edmontonenthusiast [ee] ^.T.A.L.K. 18:09, 25 November 2008 (EST).

In any case I'll follow the rules but after the treatment I received I won't edit anything out of my job interest and only in my worktime, sorry but I don't need that kind of treatment, you need to be more polite, if people are spending their time in editing the least they expected is respect.--(WT-en) Tapirlodge 22:24, 25 November 2008 (EST)

Again sorry, what more do you want? I do feel bad about this and Jani should be spoken to about this, if it makes you feel any better Jpotokal was mean to me about giving you a barnstar. But please dont stop your editing-you just need to get the rules and youll be fantastic. Keep smiling ,(WT-en) edmontonenthusiast [ee] ^.T.A.L.K. 22:46, 25 November 2008 (EST).

Your edits are very welcome here—we really need someone to take an interest in working on the Ecuador articles. Everyone makes mistakes when first working on a wiki. Above all, please do not let immature or abusive contributors turn you off to contributing—just ignore them. --(WT-en) Peter ^Talk 23:14, 25 November 2008 (EST)

Ignore me :). Sorry. (WT-en) edmontonenthusiast [ee] ^.T.A.L.K. 23:15, 25 November 2008 (EST).

Ok np. I 'll work in Ecuador articles, sorry for all th problems I make

You can learn to eliminate touting and nonsense without deleting the listing though. If a listing reads like an advert (use of 'we', vague phrases like 'best hotel in town', etc.), you can eliminate the text part of the listing, leaving only the concrete info like facilities offered (spa, pool, hair dryers, etc.) plus the contact information. If, however, the listing sounds like a contributor has actually visited there, giving evaluations like "big spacious rooms, though a little old" or "beautiful setting, but avoid the room service food", then you probably shouldn't mess with it unless you too have experienced the place as a customer. Hope that helps! (WT-en) Texugo 09:14, 26 November 2008 (EST)

Thx I will read and learn from the rules and your comments. I think that the fact that I'm Ecuadorian and a work in a travel agency in Ecuador will help me, specially because I'm the IT manager.

Que bueno. Se tienes tiempo, puede contribuir en la version en espanol tambien. Claro que los mismos principales se aplican alla tambien. (WT-en) Texugo 09:29, 26 November 2008 (EST)

No hay problema espero poder contribuir en lo que más pueda, lo que ocurre es que estoy acostumbrado por mi trabajo a remover toneladas de spam y mi concepto de spam es supongo mas detallado y el simple hecho que haya keyboard stuffing en una referencia es para mi spam, pero seguiré las normas del wiki aunque considero que la definicioón de spam deberia ser tomada en base a los lineamientos oficiales sobre el tema que se encuentran acordados en los standares a doc con los que se trabaja en seo, tale como los fijados por google, puesto que estoy seguro que muchos de los resultados de wiki travel en google se ven afectados por el hecho que google es sumanete estricto en eso, muchos de los articulos están llenos de ppp, keyboard stuffing, y no lo creo yo ya he pasado algunas de las páguinas de Ecuador de wiki traevl por herramientas seo y los resultados no son muy promisorios. seguire trabajando en lo posible para liberar el spam siguiendo los lineamientos del wiki--(WT-en) Tapirlodge 09:43, 26 November 2008 (EST)

What is your spanish saying? (WT-en) edmontonenthusiast [ee] ^.T.A.L.K. 11:57, 26 November 2008 (EST).

Que bueno. Se tienes tiempo, puede contribuir en la version en espanol tambien. Claro que los mismos principales se aplican alla tambien. (WT-en) Texugo 09:29, 26 November 2008 (EST)

Good if you have time you can also help in the Spanish version, of course the guidelines are the same there

No hay problema espero poder contribuir en lo que más pueda, lo que ocurre es que estoy acostumbrado por mi trabajo a remover toneladas de spam y mi concepto de spam es supongo mas detallado y el simple hecho que haya keyboard stuffing en una referencia es para mi spam, pero seguiré las normas del wiki aunque considero que la definicioón de spam deberia ser tomada en base a los lineamientos oficiales sobre el tema que se encuentran acordados en los standares a doc con los que se trabaja en seo, tale como los fijados por google, puesto que estoy seguro que muchos de los resultados de wiki travel en google se ven afectados por el hecho que google es sumanete estricto en eso, muchos de los articulos están llenos de ppp, keyboard stuffing, y no lo creo yo ya he pasado algunas de las páguinas de Ecuador de wiki traevl por herramientas seo y los resultados no son muy promisorios. seguire trabajando en lo posible para liberar el spam siguiendo los lineamientos del wiki--(WT-en) Tapirlodge 09:43, 26 November 2008 (EST)

np, I hope to help as much as I can, what happens is that I´m used for work reason to manage and delete tons of Spam y I suppose my concept of Spam is different, for me the keyboard stuffing in any reference is Spam, but I'll follow all the rules of the wiki, but I think that the definition of Spam must be checked based in seo a-doc standards, like the ones Google manage, because I'm sure some of the result of wikivoyage in Google are affected by keyboard stuffing and ppp, because Google have no tolerance to Spam, and I checked that with seo tool in some of the articles of Ecuador, I will keep working removing spam but under the rules of wikivoyage. ^^ sorry that the translation--(WT-en) Tapirlodge 12:12, 26 November 2008 (EST)