Talk:Berneray

Comments

Ex links

Sort of... most of the links in buy eat and sleep are all to pages on the official berneray website, not actual sites of the businesses... is that ok? (WT-en) Cacahuate 10:58, 3 December 2006 (EST)

A site doesn't necessarily have to be "www.myrestaurant.com" to be a primary link - for example, most businesses in the Falkland Islands have a URL that is a sub-page of http://tourism.org.fk/, and the businesses use that URL as their official web site. I don't know Berneray at all, so I'm not sure if that's the case here, but if it is then the links are fine. -- (WT-en) Ryan 11:02, 3 December 2006 (EST)

Doh, looks like tourism.org.fk has recently been changed... another example might be the concessions in Yosemite National Park, which are all controlled by a single agency and mostly have official sites that are pages within the concessionaire's site. -- (WT-en) Ryan 11:07, 3 December 2006 (EST)

Works for me! (WT-en) Cacahuate 11:12, 3 December 2006 (EST)

Yeah, for most of the accommodations in Berneray, the community's web site is either their official online presence, or as "primary" a source as there is online. - (WT-en) Todd VerBeek 17:41, 4 December 2006 (EST)

I live on Berneray, maintain the "official" Berneray website, and wrote the original entry on this wiki, which am currently updating. Can confirm that only 2 of the businesses on Berneray have their own website. That's what the official website for the island was set up, so all the others would have some kind of web "presence" - (WT-en) Jkirriemuir 10 December 2006

Other services

Would be nice if the Other Services could be included in a Cope Sec. And maybe a few Scottish phrases could be included in Talk, since there is no phrasebook on wikivoyage for the Gaelic language. (WT-en) Upamanyuwikitravel 11:21, 19 December 2006 (EST)

Changed "other services" to "cope"... surprised nobody noticed that sooner! But if someone decides to add phrases they should just do it in the Gaelic phrasebook page since it applies to more than Berneray. (WT-en) Cacahuate 11:42, 19 December 2006 (EST)

I think a little more could be included in a Cope Section. After all, Berneray is an off-the-beaten-path destination and facilities like ATMs, cinema halls etc are not so easily available. (WT-en) Upamanyuwikitravel 06:24, 13 January 2007 (EST)

Star -> guide

I bumped this back down from "star" to "guide". The "See" and "Do" sections don't match our Project:Manual of style for attraction listings.

I realize that Berneray is so small that it's going to be an exception to some if not all of the rules of the MoS. That means it should take longer to become a star -- we need to figure out if these exceptions meet our style guidelines. --(WT-en) Evan 11:06, 20 December 2006 (EST)

As stated on Project:Star nominations, I object violently to this rollback. A clear consensus was reached on this, and Evan, the fact that you individually do not share in that consensus does not refute its existence. Furthermore, this is exactly the kind of place that fits into the "exception that proves the rule" heading explicitly laid out in Project:Star nominations. Please explain yourself more fully, as I am about to revert this. -- (WT-en) Bill-on-the-Hill 11:38, 20 December 2006 (EST)

Conversation continued here: Project:Star_nominations#Berneray

Camping

Any idea why the "camping" section keeps getting deleted? --(WT-en) Evan 09:21, 5 April 2007 (EDT)

Because somebody got bitten by a mosquito there and is angry? Really though, I've restored it a couple times too, please don't delete it unless you've come here to tell us why... or we'll just keep re-adding it. That info was added by a Berneray resident, so we trust what he says... – (WT-en) cacahuate ^talk 20:47, 5 April 2007 (EDT)

2022 update: There is no longer free camping for motor vehicles - the only place for them is at the East Beach where there is a £10 per night charge. Walkers and cyclists are allowed to wild camp in accordance with the outdoor access code, but this should be away from houses. In the early stages of the Covid-19 pandemic the locals were discouraging visitors as the island had been infection free after travel to the islands was restricted in March - June 2020. AlasdairW (talk) 22:28, 2 August 2022 (UTC)

@AlasdairW:: Can you supply a weblink or other verification that East Beach still accepts campers? All the Hebrides have suffered from inconsiderate camping and parking, and I’m seeing so many online strictures, that I thought best to discourage unless there is a positive welcome from some quarter.

There is an area of grass next the East Beach where a sign says to put £10 per night in the box to camp. I don't know if this is online, but I saw it in July, and had a brief chat with the crofter who was mending the fence. There are no facilities - the £10 just helps the crofter maintain the area. However park4night suggests that the site might have closed a few days after I was there. I will try to find out more. The hostel no longer allows camping. AlasdairW (talk) 21:48, 30 September 2023 (UTC)

Star?

This page was rated Star, but IMO was only middling usable. Much was out of date, sections were copies of Wikitravel (those zealots of excellence only rated it outline), and the style was discursive and rambling with daffy notions of Hebridean history. Relevant background was missing.

I’ve overhauled it, re-assigning as Rural area, and would appreciate thoughts on whether this remains a Star page, and what the hell that concept looks like on such a small island.

The case for Star is that if you want WV to be first choice for independent travel advice, here’s an exemplar. How many other guides to Berneray are out there? This page stands head and shoulders above Lonely Planet, which barely spares it a paragraph, and the tourist website which is glossy but superficial.

The case against is that this page is the same standard as many others, which ought to be the par for any credible guide. Over 95% of Scotland pages are at this level and the stragglers will be hunted down by the end of this year. To the extent that Berneray has more content per size than others, it’s because background (eg on wildlife and traditional ways of life) are expounded here but belong on the Outer Hebrides page. If it’s a Star then so are several hundred others, and most of those have better amenities and amusements.Grahamsands (talk) 16:26, 30 September 2023 (UTC)

Over on WT, Berneray is both Outline and Star depending on whether you read the first or last line of the article!. It was promoted in 2006, in the high days of WT. At that time an islander had added a lot of the content.

Berneray is covered by books on the Scottish Islands, but these are not regularly revised. "The Scottish Islands" by Hamish Haswell-Smith has 2.5 A4 pages on Berneray - the history is more detailed, but there is less visitor information and my copy is 20 years old. There are also guide leaflets sold locally which are comparable to our article.

If you want to remove the star, this should be discussed on Wikivoyage:Star_nominations. It might also be good to mention there that it is changing from City to Rural Area (the first star Rural Area?). AlasdairW (talk) 22:17, 30 September 2023 (UTC)

I like this WT concept of Outline Star and Star Outline, presumably involving neutrinos. Grahamsands (talk) 19:46, 1 October 2023 (UTC)

Copy of de-star discussion:

I have no idea whether this small island merits its status, see Pro & Con on its discussion page. It's been updated and switched to Rural area. Grahamsands (talk) 19:40, 1 October 2023 (UTC)

It's a good article, but it isn't star status. I see several flaws in formatting and style. However, some of these may be able to be corrected. First, I recall our style guide directing that bulleted content should be prose unless it must be a bulleted list. The references to animal species, for example, should be converted to prose without bullet points. Hyphens are used where a dash would be more appropriate, and some sections don't have enough content. In fact, some listings are also listing coordinates, which would put even guide status in question. I believe some of these changes would benefit from research or local knowledge to be corrected. --Comment by Selfie City (talk) (contributions) 02:03, 2 October 2023 (UTC)

• Oppose Barring updates, Special:PermaLink/4733626 was very much star-worthy – it's far more readable, instead of the current endless list of bulletted POIs with useful information hidden in a fluff of text. No, I'm absolutely opposed to removing the star from an article that was very much star-worthy before an overhaul (something that *shouldn't* be done on star articles). --SHB2000 (talk | contribs | meta) 02:45, 2 October 2023 (UTC)

Outcome: star retained. Only one vote pro and one against so status quo is maintained. Grahamsands (talk) 16:15, 22 September 2024 (UTC)