Hello, Vm limo! Thank you for contributing to Wikivoyage, but please note that one or more of your recent edits has been reverted as it appeared to be an attempt to use this site to advertise or promote a business or service. Wikivoyage is created by travellers for travellers, and while business owners and employees are welcome to contribute, use of this site for promotional purposes is not allowed.
If you feel that your edits were incorrectly identified as promotional, please read Wikivoyage's guidelines on identifying promotional edits. If, after reading that guideline, you still feel your edits were incorrectly removed, please use this talk page or the talk page of the article where your edit was removed to explain why your change was not promotional. Note that it is very important that you discuss your proposed change before re-adding it since repeated promotional edits can lead to a temporary block of your account's ability to edit Wikivoyage, and in serious cases the business in question may be blacklisted from Wikivoyage.
Ikan Kekek (talk) 08:42, 20 February 2023 (UTC)
- I'm going to have to block you for an initial period of 3 days. During that time, you can try to argue why your limo company should be mentioned and linked on umpteen articles. Ikan Kekek (talk) 08:11, 21 February 2023 (UTC)
- Hello, I saw that you blocked me because I added my service on few different cities that we operate. We mainly operate on Järvenpää, Tuusula, Sipoo, Nurmijärvi, Hyvinkää and Kerava. My message was "Orders via booking platform (Smartphone app or web-based). Pricing for luxury sedan (1-3 passengers) Initial fee 15,00€, 1,25€ / km, 1,00€ / min.". I saw that for example company named Petax have their service on Järvenpää, Tuusula and Kerava. Vm limo (talk) 08:32, 21 February 2023 (UTC)
- How many articles had you planned on listing yourself in? I'm also a bit skeptical that we need to list luxury limo operators. Ikan Kekek (talk) 08:39, 21 February 2023 (UTC)
- Well we live in Järvenpää but our service area is Järvenpää, Kerava, Tuusula, Sipoo, Nurmijärvi and Hyvinkää Vm limo (talk) 08:44, 21 February 2023 (UTC)
- Well I don't know where you live, but here everything is more like a taxi operators. There is different culture on taxis. That "luxury limo" as you describe usually means here that car kept clean, there is bit more room and cars are like Mercedes e-series as usual taxi operators use cars like Skoda Octavia and such sometimes in horrible shape. I think our service might be good fit for your site. Was that ban because I started to add our different service areas or because I wrote something wrong? Is it better describe something like "Booking platform (Smartphone app or web-based) that calculates route based on distance and time used. Pricing for 1-3 passengers: Initial fee 15,00€, 1,25€ / km, 1,00€ / min. " so that is not for promote purposes? Vm limo (talk) 08:56, 21 February 2023 (UTC)
- https://www.mtvuutiset.fi/artikkeli/suomalaisten-luottamus-taksiliikenteeseen-on-romahtanut-viidessa-vuodessa-asuinalueella-vaikutusta-luottamukseen/8620940#gs.qm6o6r
- https://www.is.fi/taloussanomat/art-2000009356814.html
- https://www.iltalehti.fi/kotimaa/a/042fc86b-918c-4535-87fc-b6e9fea12b4f
- Few links on recent research. They are on Finnish text so you might have to use translator, all on big Finnish news sites. Mtvuutiset is tv channel and is and iltalehti is 2 biggest daily magazines. All the links say that reliability is lost. On 2018 finnnish covernment opened taxi industry and nowadays almost anyone can be taxi. After 2018 driver, car and price can be anything if you take ride from local stations. So we are more like traditional taxi even tho we have that "limo" word on our name, you have to separate yourself from the others and in our case, name is one that helps build trust, as our customers might have used "luxury limo" services from other countries. Our main thing is reliability, not that we have always luxury limo picking you up. I think we are good additional to your site. I believe that people wants to have reliable taxi than some random. Vm limo (talk) 09:22, 21 February 2023 (UTC)
- I understand that you might think that it's spammy, even tho that's our service area. I still think that its good option to have us as one option for people who is visiting to this citys. We have base here in Järvenpää so I would at least have that as one place. Then for example there is no operators listed on Sipoo, Nurmijärvi or Hyvinkää, which is our service areas. Wouldn't it be suppose to have some reliable operator than no operator at all on those areas? There is Petax on Tuusula and Kerava which I would like to have myself also in but at least there is one operator. Vm limo (talk) 09:51, 21 February 2023 (UTC)
- [edit conflict] The most recent listing was less touty, but you still don't have the warning about limited availability that you have on your web page, encouraging people to book in advance, and call rather than use the app for last-minute orders. I think it is OK to add the listing to Järvenpää, if it concentrates on information, not touting the luxury aspect (most Finnish taxis are findcomfortable and reliable, so that's not something to emphasise). I am sorry that we don't have a region article suiting your service area; Uusimaa#By taxi only lists the biggest players, which I assume cover all the region. –LPfi (talk) 10:07, 21 February 2023 (UTC)
- I haven't been following the taxi development that closely. I know about the concerns, but cannot judge the extent of the problems. The taxis I see in the street here in Turku look nice and I have had no problems with the taxis I have used. At Wikivoyage, we have the additional problem that we have a difficult time judging individual operators. I trust you to keep good standards, but what about somebody else claiming the same? I think your targeting a premium segment rather than those aiming for the lowest prices should be clear from the listing, but I think that is about as much as should be said. For the number of articles where to list you, our normal standard is one article only for one business. We are flexible when alternatives are scarce, but I suppose there are quite many taxis in Kerava or Sipoo, so calling Lähitaxi would get me a car without much delay in most cases. –LPfi (talk) 10:14, 21 February 2023 (UTC)
- I am unblocking you now, but I hope you don't try to readd the listings right away. The block was not only because of your adding the listings, but because you seemed to ignore the message on your talk page and the reverts. If you listen, then no blocks are needed. Let's hear what Ikan Kekek has to say on what listings there could be (he isn't from Finland, but has more experience of this site). –LPfi (talk) 10:23, 21 February 2023 (UTC)
- It's true that I haven't been to Finland, but I'm skeptical that Mercedes limos would be patronized by more than a niche of rich people or businesspeople on expense accounts. I live in New York, and I see plenty of limos on the streets, but we don't list limo services in the New York City article and figure that anyone who wants one can find information about several companies themselves. It can sometimes be reasonable to list the one or two taxi companies in places where the only option is to call a cab or book one online, but we've had a lot of experience with individual companies touting their services exclusively (and in multiple articles) when they have lots of competition, or in some cases, spammy lists of x-number of taxi and limo companies grow and eventually someone deletes the list, figuring that with that many options, there's no need to list any, and that such sections are mainly a target for touts. I'm willing to defer to other established users who are familiar with Finland if they think a single listing is OK. It may be best to start a thread at Talk:Järvenpää and seek comments for a few days, to see if a consensus develops. Ikan Kekek (talk) 11:34, 21 February 2023 (UTC)
- Ok, thank you. Vm limo (talk) 12:36, 21 February 2023 (UTC)
- Okey. I admit that I might have added few too many links to our site, as I saw that Petax have their link on different cities aswell.
- Our price is actually lower than nationwide operator Valopilkku so I don't know if I'm targeting more of a premium segment or not and if you check prices on Turku, I guess our pricing might even be bit lower than random taxi there... but lets not talk about pricing, its what it is. Our goal is to provide quality service and that's what matters, and I think it will also help your customers choose reliable operator.
- So can I add listing on Järvenpää now? I leave it only for Järvenpää, as we have "base" there and we can serve more like a 24/7 operator in Järvenpää. If I make my message like "Pricing for 1-3 passengers: Initial fee 9,00€, 1,25€ / km, 1,00€ / min, pre-order fee 6,00€ via booking platform (Smartphone app or web-based) that calculates price based on distance and time used." to that listing, I guess its more of a informative way to say everything. Vm limo (talk) 12:10, 21 February 2023 (UTC)
- I see you added it already. We are all volunteers here, so it is generally a good idea to wait a few days if you want a response. As I said above, I don't think a listing in Järvenpää is a problem. However, I am a bit confused about the details. The first time you added the listing it said that the initial fee is €15, in a later one it said pre-booking is compulsory, now it says the initial cost is €9, +€6 if pre-booking. The price is comparable to other operators' night and weekend fee. However, usually you don't pre-book, and an unexpected +€6 isn't something I want our readers to experience in Finland. I didn't find the pricing information on your web page, which is odd, and could be a reason to delete the listing, as I cannot check that the info is correct (if a random user updates it) and up to date (if it hasn't been changed lately). –LPfi (talk) 16:40, 21 February 2023 (UTC)
- It's true that I haven't been to Finland, but I'm skeptical that Mercedes limos would be patronized by more than a niche of rich people or businesspeople on expense accounts. I live in New York, and I see plenty of limos on the streets, but we don't list limo services in the New York City article and figure that anyone who wants one can find information about several companies themselves. It can sometimes be reasonable to list the one or two taxi companies in places where the only option is to call a cab or book one online, but we've had a lot of experience with individual companies touting their services exclusively (and in multiple articles) when they have lots of competition, or in some cases, spammy lists of x-number of taxi and limo companies grow and eventually someone deletes the list, figuring that with that many options, there's no need to list any, and that such sections are mainly a target for touts. I'm willing to defer to other established users who are familiar with Finland if they think a single listing is OK. It may be best to start a thread at Talk:Järvenpää and seek comments for a few days, to see if a consensus develops. Ikan Kekek (talk) 11:34, 21 February 2023 (UTC)
- I am unblocking you now, but I hope you don't try to readd the listings right away. The block was not only because of your adding the listings, but because you seemed to ignore the message on your talk page and the reverts. If you listen, then no blocks are needed. Let's hear what Ikan Kekek has to say on what listings there could be (he isn't from Finland, but has more experience of this site). –LPfi (talk) 10:23, 21 February 2023 (UTC)
- I haven't been following the taxi development that closely. I know about the concerns, but cannot judge the extent of the problems. The taxis I see in the street here in Turku look nice and I have had no problems with the taxis I have used. At Wikivoyage, we have the additional problem that we have a difficult time judging individual operators. I trust you to keep good standards, but what about somebody else claiming the same? I think your targeting a premium segment rather than those aiming for the lowest prices should be clear from the listing, but I think that is about as much as should be said. For the number of articles where to list you, our normal standard is one article only for one business. We are flexible when alternatives are scarce, but I suppose there are quite many taxis in Kerava or Sipoo, so calling Lähitaxi would get me a car without much delay in most cases. –LPfi (talk) 10:14, 21 February 2023 (UTC)
- How many articles had you planned on listing yourself in? I'm also a bit skeptical that we need to list luxury limo operators. Ikan Kekek (talk) 08:39, 21 February 2023 (UTC)