Talk:Passport

See also: Talk:Passport/Archive

Russian internal passport

Russian (and Ukrainian) internal passport does not prevent people from flowing from one region to another. Actually, it's just an internal ID, though in irritatingly outdated form. —The preceding comment was added by 88.201.200.20 (talk • contribs)

Entering your home country on a different passport illegal?

Question about this recent contribution:

"Some countries allow dual citizenship, but do not allow their own citizens to use a foreign passport to enter or leave the country. (eg. Australia and the United States of America)"

How is this enforced? I don't believe it can be. Additionally, is it actually illegal to do this? Andrewssi2 (talk) 05:50, 7 December 2013 (UTC)

As far as I am aware, it is only the newer and more insecure states such as China, Germany and South Africa that actively forbid multiple citizenship.

Section 215 of the Immigration and Nationality Act (8 U.S.C. 1185) requires US citizens to use US passports when entering or leaving the United States unless one of the exceptions listed in Section 53.2 of Title 22 of the Code of Federal Regulations applies.

(As an example, one of these exceptions permits a child under the age of 12, who is included in the non-US passport of a parent who has no claim to US citizenship, to enter the United States without a US passport, provided the child presents evidence of his/her US citizenship when entering the United States.)

The South African Citizenship Act, 1995 as amended, provides in a new section 26B that adult South African citizens who

1) enter the Republic or depart from the Republic making use of the passport of another country; or

2) while in the Republic, make use of their citizenship or nationality of another country in order to gain an advantage or avoid a responsibility or duty,

are guilty of an offence and liable on conviction to a fine or to imprisonment for a period not exceeding 12 months”.

Canada has had problems with its citizens of Iranian and Chinese ethnic origin being executed and imprisoned when they return "home" and states on its website: "...Always use your Canadian passport if possible, especially when entering the country of your second citizenship... Using your Canadian passport may provide the basis under which Canada can provide you with consular assistance if you run into problems. You should also obtain a visa, if that is required for entry by Canadian citizens, and always present yourself as a Canadian when dealing with local authorities."

On the same website it also writes "Canadian citizens returning to Canada who present other documents, such as a Certificate of Canadian Citizenship, birth certificate, provincial driver’s licence or foreign passport, instead of a Canadian passport, may face delays or be denied boarding by transport companies."

In regard to Australia (and many other countries that require all entrants apart from their nationals to have a visa to enter), I believe the issue is also one of practicality rather than legal compulsion.

Airlines increasingly have hefty financial obligations to ensure that they only carry appropriately documented passengers. In the absence of an Australian passport, airlines may be unable to verify a claim of Australian citizenship at the time of check-in and may refuse boarding. (The airline may have the theoretical possibility to make inquiries with the Department of Immigration and Border Protection in Australia to seek approval to carry the passenger, but this all takes time and may cause the plane to depart without you. Taking your Australian passport and using it to depart from and return to Australia may be the route of least hassle, since an Australian citizen cannot be granted a visa for Australia, so technically if your other passport is not Kiwi, then you'll need to submit an incomplete visa application to enter Australia.

Technically, if you arrive by yacht, you can be entry cleared without getting your foreign passport stamped if they are satisfied you are Australian since, when entering Australia, all Australians, including those who hold multiple nationalities, must be able to prove that they are an Australian citizen. An Australian passport is conclusive evidence of a person's Australian identity and citizenship and provides the holder with right of entry to Australia. Official sources say "An Australian citizen who arrives without an Australian passport may be delayed until their identity and claims to enter Australia have been checked. If a foreign passport holder claims to be an Australian citizen, immigration officers must confirm and verify this through official databases, which will cause delays."

--118.93nzp (talk) 23:42, 7 December 2013 (UTC)

Thanks! Although my question was a bit more mundane that the status of dual nationality and the mutual recognition between states as well as diplomatic coverage.

The original text suggested that if (for example) you were a citizen of two countries, then you would not be allowed to use the passport of one country for purposes of travel in the other. Actually, it is unclear why you would actually want to do this in the first place, but let's say we did in some obscure edge case scenario, is it actually not allowed? Andrewssi2 (talk) 01:26, 8 December 2013 (UTC)

Your South African example is probably the closest to answering this. I know that Germany and South Korea have similar policies in order to prevent the avoidance of national service. Andrewssi2 (talk) 01:29, 8 December 2013 (UTC)

Many counties do not recognise dual or multiple citizenship, the US being a the biggest example. That does not make it illegal to have multiple citizenship in these countries. However, if you try to enter one of these countries with a foreign passport instead of your own passport, they could consider that you have entered illegally if they later find out you are one of their citizens. This is purely because they will not regard your other nationalities as valid. There was a well reported case in Uzbekistan, where a retired war veteran from the country received Russian citizenship and passport and was imprisoned in Uzbekistan for using his Russian passport to enter. Under Uzbekistan's interpretation of its law he had entered the country on an invalid passport.Davidbstanley (talk) 08:12, 27 December 2013 (UTC)

Cuban stamps for non-US citizens

I know a number of Canadians who have visited Cuba, some of them more than once. They say it is quite pleasant and there are a lot of Europeans there as well.

If one of those people later visits the US, is a Cuban stamp in the passport likely to be a problem? In many cases it will not matter because they won't notice and in some cases the border officials may just be in the mood to hassle you so any excuse will do, but what of the other cases? Does anyone know of a US policy on this? Pashley (talk) 14:58, 28 December 2013 (UTC)

I had a quick Google. It looks like the Cuban immigration will only stamp a separate tourist card/visa. They would not stamp your passport unless you specifically ask them to. There are many reports of people with Cuban stamps not having any problems entering the US. Davidbstanley (talk) 15:36, 28 December 2013 (UTC)

I've never heard of any citizen of any country other than the US having trouble entering the US merely because they had previously visited Cuba. Ikan Kekek (talk) 22:40, 28 December 2013 (UTC)

Languages

Can we get official confirmation on the language requirements for passports?

Our text previously stated that all passports had English and French plus at least one local language (unless English and French covered all such). Now it just says they all have English plus local languages. But Wikipedia says that the recommendation is for (both English and French) or (a local language and [either English or French]). If correct, that implies that some passports don't have English, which would be contrary to our current text.

Anyone have a definitive source?

-- Powers ^(talk) 02:26, 23 August 2015 (UTC)

WP has a bit on w:Passport#Designs and format and w:Passport#Languages which is poorly sourced and contains errors.

The underlying standard is the ICAO recommendation, DOC9303 which specifies the booklet's physical dimensions and the one page with the voyager's photo and biographic data only. The "Visual Inspection Zone" (chapter 4.1) has basic info like name and nationality in the Western (Latin) character set. The word "PASSPORT" (en), "PASSEPORT" (fr) or "PASAPORTE" (es) must appear in the country's own language and in one of English, French or Spanish; the voyager's gender (M, F, X if not specified) must also be in that/those language(s). The country abbreviation is an ISO standard three letter code (ESP = españa, FRA = français...) and dates are in a standard format. The rest of this doesn't need to be translated at all.

None of the other pages has an internationally-standard official format. Blank pages for entry stamps, blurbs about the passport being the property of the issuing government, who requests safe passage for its citizens, the space for address of next of kin, information on obtaining consular assistance, the nation's coat of arms that usually turns up on the cover, none of it matters. K7L (talk) 05:26, 23 August 2015 (UTC)

"best passport" article

[1] Pashley (talk) 13:54, 7 September 2015 (UTC)

Non-Free Link

I was asked on the history to explain why adding a link to [2] would be helpful for the How To Apply heading. This article is about Passports. That heading is for applying for a passport. All passports require a passport photo. Because of that, anyone who is reading that section and looking for information about applying for a passport would need a passport photo. The heading lists places where one can get a passport photo such as a photo studio. The app I linked to lets one take a passport photo with a smartphone and pick it up at a pharmacy or have it delivered. This is convenient for individuals who can not or do not want to go to other services such as a pharmacy. Yes, it is non-free as well as all other passport photo options like a photo studio or pharmacy. In fact, the price of the app is less than the price of photo at a pharmacy - so I don't see why it'll be a problem to link to a lower cost passport photo option. I also listed other options in my original edit too such as USPS. I think listing places where one can get a passport photo would make this article more useful for travellers. It might need to be a new heading or new page if it gets that large. Would it be OK to re-add the page? 24.127.60.32 20:47, 9 August 2016 (UTC)

The problem is that we don't want to become a dumping ground for links to every remotely travel-related app out there. Once we open the door to this particular app -- one of several, I assume, that can do passport photos -- we open the door to all the others as well. Powers ^(talk) 23:00, 9 August 2016 (UTC)

Also, a quick search of free passport photo applications turned up some results. I can't vouch for them, but I don't think payment is required. -- Ikan Kekek (talk) 03:15, 10 August 2016 (UTC)

Also, some countries have very specific requirements. It may have changed, but a few years ago Canada wanted one picture to have date, time & the photographer's signature on the back. Mine also had the studio's address & phone number, but I don't know if that was required. Pashley (talk) 00:31, 18 October 2016 (UTC)

As inflexible as always: http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/passport/apply/photos.asp K7L (talk) 06:26, 18 October 2016 (UTC)

USA and Cuba

I had the impression that the thaw between USA and Cuba means travelling between the countries is now allowed both ways like between countries with normal relations. Is this just wishful thinking, something to happen "soon" or is the info on the page outdated? --LPfi (talk) 19:15, 17 October 2016 (UTC)

For Americans, plain tourism in Cuba is still disallowed, you need to have some official or professional reason to go there legally. For Cubans going to the US I don't think there are any other hurdles that they have to get a visa (of course every Cuban may in practice not get a passport, they apparently needed a separate exit permit every time they wanted to leave the country until 2013). ϒpsilon (talk) 19:26, 17 October 2016 (UTC)

"you should use on entry the passport you used to check in with for the flight"

I saw the following statement : "Equally challenging: if you are flying into a country, you should use on entry the passport you used to check in with for the flight."

Is this universally true? I can believe that with a country with a very in-depth entry regime (such as the US) then it would look very bad to try and enter on a different passport than the one you registered with ESTA. Many other countries (e.g. China) have visitor visas stamped right into you passport before your journey, so using another passport is also a no go. However, on the other hand many countries really don't care. --Andrewssi2 (talk) 06:16, 6 April 2017 (UTC)

Can we change this or am I missing something? --Andrewssi2 (talk) 06:16, 6 April 2017 (UTC)

Hand written and machine readable

I wonder about two passages:

Passports with handwritten front pages still exist, although they are being phased out due to security concerns.

Seems odd. The front page is presumable identical, so why not use the print? Should this be changed to information page?

machine-readable passports wherein the personal data page is automated have been gradually introduced. That information is also encoded into two strips at the bottom of the page.

Isn't the whole point of the strips that they are machine readable? Is the "also" superfluous?

--LPfi (talk) 06:46, 6 April 2017 (UTC)

The second issue resolved. I reworded the paragraph. --LPfi (talk) 07:31, 6 April 2017 (UTC)

And I changed the first. Hopefully correct this way. --LPfi (talk) 13:30, 13 April 2017 (UTC)

Traveling with a Third World passport

Swept in from the pub

https://www.bucketlistly.blog/posts/how-to-travel-third-world-passport-thai —Justin (koavf)❤T☮C☺M☯ 21:33, 16 August 2018 (UTC)

COVID-19 stops passport issue

U.S. Stops Issuing Passports Except For 'Life-Or-Death' Emergencies. Details at State Department site.

Are other countries doing this? Pashley (talk) 04:23, 6 April 2020 (UTC)

Uruguay is. Apparently something similar in Canada. By the way, I think the US is still doing passport renewals by mail. —Granger (talk · contribs) 11:54, 6 April 2020 (UTC)

Descent

5 passports you can obtain through descent: Ireland, Italy, Greece, Poland & Portugal. Pashley (talk) 08:13, 30 April 2020 (UTC)

Changes?

Another travel site has The days of US passport dominance may be over, but I'm sure the US will not be the only country affected. Pashley (talk) 17:40, 1 June 2020 (UTC)

From the article "The US passport grants access to 184 of the world’s 195 countries". Does this mean visa-free travel? That cannot be true. In Africa many if not most countries require visas from everyone but citizens of neighboring countries. Russia, China, and many of the lesser visited countries in Asia also let rather few nationalities in visa-free.

Or does it mean that Americans aren't allowed into 11 countries (or they're banned by the U.S. government to go there)? Citizens of for e.g. European nationalities don't have such limitations... --Ypsilon (talk) 18:10, 1 June 2020 (UTC)

The article is simply wrong. I suspect it should be 184 countries and territories, out of a total of well over 200.

U.S. government bans on U.S. citizen travel apply to only two countries as far as I know: Cuba and North Korea. —Granger (talk · contribs) 18:12, 1 June 2020 (UTC)

What about Iran? Hobbitschuster (talk) 18:17, 1 June 2020 (UTC)

Per the infobox in Iran#Get_in, apparently Americans must be watched by a tour guide all the time. --Ypsilon (talk) 18:20, 1 June 2020 (UTC)

For anyone who is interested, here are the passport rankings for visa-free travel. Germany, Finland, Singapore, and a dozen other countries score higher than the U.S. —Granger (talk · contribs) 18:32, 1 June 2020 (UTC)

I don't think it's necessarily visa-free travel. I think it includes electronic visas for which you can apply online without heading to the embassy, as well as visa-on-arrival. So that will include things like Australia's ETA, or the visa-on-arrival many Western countries have for Cambodia. The dog2 (talk) 23:30, 1 June 2020 (UTC)

COVID restrictions

American Passports Are Worthless Now (Map) Pashley (talk) 23:31, 10 July 2020 (UTC)

It's the obvious policy. You have to prevent plague carriers from showing up. This is the same reason New York, New Jersey and Connecticut require travelers from a bunch of states with high COVID positivity to self-quarantine for 14 days on arrival, subject to a heavy fine if they are caught violating it. Ikan Kekek (talk) 23:47, 10 July 2020 (UTC)

Norway

Norway’s newly redesigned passport is the world’s fanciest Pashley (talk) 03:51, 10 November 2020 (UTC)

Enhanced Driver Licence

These look to be a dying breed; Canada's three most populous provinces have either stopped issuing them or intend to do so, leaving only tiny Manitoba. WP has an article, but are they even still worth mentioning here?

Unrecognised countries

Should we have a section on unrecognised countries? If you e.g. are from Kosovo, there are lots of places that don't recognise your government. I suppose they might not recognise your passport either in that case. In some cases, you can get a passport from the country the territory is counted to belong to, such as from Serbia if you are from Kosovo, or some other travel document from a country where you are resident. Does somebody know how these issues are handled? –LPfi (talk) 09:47, 7 November 2021 (UTC)

I don't know to be fair but I think it's worth adding a section on that. But what about Israel? Israel isn't recognised by a fair amount of countries but its UN recognised. SHB2000 (talk | contribs | meta.wikimedia) 09:50, 7 November 2021 (UTC)

Does someone living in the occupied territories get an Israeli passport? If so, does the Israeli government impose restrictions on who can have one? And will someplace like Saudi Arabia that does not recognise Israel accept such a passport?

Or do they get a passport from the Palestinian Authority? If so, are there countries that will not accept that? Pashley (talk) 10:32, 7 November 2021 (UTC)

We have an article about passport acceptance; Visa trouble. --Ypsilon (talk) 10:35, 7 November 2021 (UTC)

It is about trouble getting into territories claiming independence, about avoiding to show Israeli stamps (there are similar issues with other countries, but these seem not to be covered), and the policy of USA. It does not handle people whose normal passport isn't recognised in some countries. As their problem isn't about visas but about their passport, I think this is a better place for the advice. –LPfi (talk) 16:11, 7 November 2021 (UTC)

I agree that this is probably the right article to cover this. I'm not sure there's much we can say in general besides "If your passport is issued by a country with limited recognition, other countries may or may not recognize it, and this may vary by destination." I have to imagine the situation varies quite a bit depending on who issues the passport; an Israeli passport is surely more widely accepted than a Somaliland passport, for instance. —Granger (talk · contribs) 17:27, 7 November 2021 (UTC)

The visa trouble article does state "Kosovan passports are not recognized by most Commonwealth of Independent States countries, Ukraine, Georgia, Lebanon, Cuba and Venezuela.", though. Also concering Taiwan: While Taiwanese passports are accepted for travel to most countries, in some cases diplomatic and official passports are not accepted even if ordinary passports are. --Ypsilon (talk) 17:50, 7 November 2021 (UTC)

It does seem reasonable to cover this topic. On the specific questions of Palestinians living in the Occupied Territories, many West Bank and East Jerusalem Arabs have Jordanian passports. Many Druses who reside in the Golan Heights have Syrian passports, too. That's not a full answer, but these are things I know. I imagine someone more knowledgeable will address how other Palestinians deal with international travel, but I would point out that a certain number of Israeli Arabs every year are welcome to travel to Saudi Arabia with their Israeli passports to go on the Haj. Ikan Kekek (talk) 22:00, 7 November 2021 (UTC)

Governments refusing or invalidating passports

A Tibetan I knew told me none of his family could get a passport because some family members were with the Dalai Lama in India. The US invalidated Ed Snowden's passport. The UK refuses admission to some people who have British passports because they went to ISIS-controlled areas. During the Cold War, the Western press claimed a Russian passport was hard to get; I do not know how accurate those claims were or if they apply today.

Should the article cover such restrictions? Pashley (talk) 23:54, 7 November 2021 (UTC)

I'm thinking only when we have hard data and it really seems travel-related. I don't think Snowden is going to be consulting a Wikivoyage article for information about his passport status. Ikan Kekek (talk) 01:08, 8 November 2021 (UTC)

I think that the UK case refers to a dual national who lost her UK nationality because she went to ISIS territory. This is very much an exteme case, and doesn't belong here. It would be much more useful to describe how countries have restricted citizens' ability to return home during the pandemic. AlasdairW (talk) 21:09, 8 November 2021 (UTC)