Latest comment: 3 years ago7 comments2 people in discussion
How shall we write about the unofficial Sale bypass. While currently we've written follow C106, C491 and C492; parts of the unofficial bypass are unnumbered. Writing names will be wordy which is not something we want. Opinions welcome SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 02:31, 7 March 2021 (UTC)Reply
I'm thinking of two questions: (1) How many names would there be? (2) Are there signs for this unofficial bypass if you don't know the names of the street(s)? Ikan Kekek (talk) 07:39, 7 March 2021 (UTC)Reply
The answers to (1) - There is a fair few long names but with no signs out there. (2) - No there aren't, except for the ones that say "To A1 Princes Hwy". But going from the C106 section, its straightforward; use C106, C492, "To A1" and C491. Not the case for the other side. SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 10:14, 7 March 2021 (UTC)Reply
I don't know what a "fair few" would mean. I guess the question is how important you consider it to be for readers to understand how to take this unmarked route. Ikan Kekek (talk) 10:33, 7 March 2021 (UTC)Reply
Didn't see this, was just about to pop over here and ask what could be done to make it a star. The Sale article definitely needs expanding and I might work on that, but I'm not really sure if Sale listings should be added here. As for significance, @SHB2000: are there any listings you think that specifically need expanding? I've just returned recently from Stratford but I can't think of much to add. --LivelyRatification (talk) 00:21, 22 April 2021 (UTC)Reply
Hi all! I've been working on upgrading the Stratford (Australia) article to make it suitable for guide status, adding a map, an understand section, and a few other changes on the road to making it a useful guide in its own right. Would someone mind taking a look over at the state of the article, and giving me their thoughts on what needs to be done to achieve guide status? --LivelyRatification (talk) 01:41, 3 March 2021 (UTC)Reply
It's good but the shields are out of date (at the bottom). Anyway, I'm currently working on AUshield, like what's on en.wiki so the shields will be up soon. But for the timebeing; place {{AUshield|VIC|A1}} which'll produce Template:AUshield [[[User:SHB2000|SHB2000]] (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 08:46, 3 March 2021 (UTC)Reply
My first observation was that geo had a sign error, so the full page map was just a load of sea! - I have corrected this. I am surprised that there is no mention of Maffra, if only because it has a Woolworths supermarket. Why is the Stratford Historical Museum not listed? I think it has some way to go before it is a guide, but a lot of good work has been done in the past week. AlasdairW (talk) 22:01, 4 March 2021 (UTC)Reply
Thanks for fixing that! I didn't think to include Maffra, but that's probably worth adding. As for the historical society, I've visited there in January and I've been meaning to add it, just need to check out their Facebook as they don't have a website -- main reason why Wa-De-Lock, Stratford Motel, etc weren't listed until an unregistered user added it. I'll add them a bit later today and do Maffra right now. --LivelyRatification (talk) 01:50, 5 March 2021 (UTC)Reply
I think this article fits the requirements for star status. There's a variety of good quality images in the article to enhance the reader's understanding, there's both a static and dynamic map, and most sections are basically comprehensive. The listings are well detailed where need be, and the ones that aren't are fairly self explanatory: for example, Hobbies Plus is a model train store, and there's not much more to say. I've also gone through the article to abbreviate "Road" and "Street" where needed and sort listings in alphabetical order, and so I think it's pretty good when it comes to the manual of style. And not to toot my own horn too much, but I think the prose is easy to understand and helpful for travellers. --LivelyRatif
ication (talk) 00:51, 23 April 2021 (UTC)Reply
Comment: Looks pretty damn comprehensive for what it is. That said, a couple sections look like they should be either expanded or omitted. "Cope", for instance, is currently a one-line section. Per Wikivoyage:Article skeleton templates/Sections#Cope, such sections tend to be a bit heterogeneous/miscellaneous, and gives examples of things a traveller may be interested in that you could expand that section with -- for instance, religious institutions and beauty services. Vaticidalprophet (talk) 10:37, 24 April 2021 (UTC)Reply
I added "Cope", I think, just before nominating this, and I'm not entirely sure why I forgot to add in religious institutions. Anyway, I've now added them in. Unfortunately, I'm not entirely sure of their service times, apart from St Andrew's Uniting Church, as they have a website. I'll try looking into other services but I'm not aware of any (for example, Stratford used to have a hairdresser but no longer does). --LivelyRatification (talk) 12:05, 24 April 2021 (UTC)Reply
Very close - apart from the three questions I asked in hidden comments, some of the listings need more detail: opening hours should be provided for every single listing, as should room rates for Sleep listings. Overall, a great small town article.--ThunderingTyphoons! (talk) 13:34, 24 April 2021 (UTC)Reply
I've fixed the 3 issues you've raised, and I'm currently getting on top of adding opening hours and room rates. Hopefully it should be done by the end of the day: need to get opening hours for the op shop and rates for the motel. Will keep you updated.--LivelyRatification (talk) 23:42, 24 April 2021 (UTC)Reply
Cool, looks great now. Could you put a note in 'Sleep' stating that accommodation options are limited to those three (if that's indeed the case)? Also, is it me or do all the phone numbers look different now? Shouldn't there some be spacing in them somewhere? Other than those minor points, I'm ready to support.--ThunderingTyphoons! (talk) 12:33, 5 May 2021 (UTC)Reply
Oops, didn’t see this. I’ll add a note in the sleep section accordingly. @SHB2000: was the one who changed the phone numbers, and speaking purely aesthetically and subjectively, I preferred the original formatting, but this formatting I believe is for internationalisation purposes. That being said, I think there should be a gap between +61, which is the country code, and the rest of the digits. I’ve pinged SHB in case they have any objection to me making that change (won’t do it right now as I’m on mobile) --LivelyRatification (talk) 05:41, 9 May 2021 (UTC)Reply
"Tickets aren't actually available in Stratford, oddly enough, so if you want to take the train back to Melbourne, you have to get the ticket from Sale train station" – or buy a return ticket in Melbourne, right? I'm guessing this is only a problem if you arrive in Stratford without already having a ticket out, but please confirm. If I'm understanding correctly, let's add "if you don't already have a ticket" or something like that to clarify.
"The reserve also has an oval and benches which may be used by local groups." I'm not sure what this means. Is the point that it's used by Gunaikurnai people for meetings, or that it's used by some other groups?
Where does the Arts Trail begin and end – how do I get to the trailhead?
More details needed about the Shakespeare on the River Festival – where in town is it held? How much do tickets cost? Are the performances any good?
Apparently one of the accommodation options is located at a wildlife shelter. Can the wildlife shelter be visited by travellers who aren't staying at the hotel? Is it worth a visit?
The banner doesn't do much for me – can we find a more attractive banner photo?
I can't tell how thorough the article's coverage is, but I don't see any red flags. It's enjoyable to read, and piques my interest in visiting Stratford if I ever find myself in Victoria. —Granger (talk·contribs) 06:17, 9 May 2021 (UTC)Reply
Thanks for your questions! You’re correct about the ticket thing, it’s only an issue if you don’t buy a return ticket. Granted, that section is probably biased somewhat by the fact that I found myself in that position, but it could be clarified. I’m unaware if the Gunaikurnai people use it specifically, but I am aware that local community groups have held events there. Perhaps it’s a bit redundant, but I thought it might be good to put there to inform readers it may be busy. I have no idea about the Arts Trail’s specific route, and when I visited the Segue Cafe in April, they told me they didn’t currently have a map of it, but you can access the Avon River from a path at the corner of McMillan and McFarlane Street. Where exactly the events are held for the festival vary (I’ve unfortunately never had the chance to see it), but events are mainly held in the Stratford Courthouse, which is in the same building as the Segue Cafe. Prices do also vary, and I’m wary of providing prices based on this year as they are prone to change. I’ve never visited the shelter, so again, I can’t comment. As for the banner photo, I’m sure there are some alternatives that I could try, either based off what’s already on Commons or from my own personal photo gallery. --LivelyRatification (talk) 06:47, 9 May 2021 (UTC)Reply
Can’t use CropTool right now for obvious reasons but here are some photos I’ve found from my gallery — and , would either one of these make a better header? Also fun fact about my userpage banner is that Tyers Street is actually misspelled on the image as Tyres (as in car tyres) Street. --LivelyRatification (talk) 07:12, 9 May 2021 (UTC)Reply
┌────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────┘Support - the article looks very good. You have to zoom out a bit to see all of the listings and the mapshape, and the 'Shakespeare on the River Festival' listing says that the date that the listing was last changed needs updating - I don't know why this is, but it could be that the listing was updated but the date wasn't? Other than this, I think that the article is fine. 82.3.185.1218:20, 9 May 2021 (UTC)Reply
The map thing is by design. It's zoomed into the main street as that's where all but 2 of the listings are. I have no idea why the listing is doing that, that's really weird. --LivelyRatification (talk) 20:15, 9 May 2021 (UTC)Reply
Close Another article which was started this year. A few points:
Unless the town is world famous for roof tiles, it needs a new banner.
Understand could have a paragraph describing the town today - population, major employers etc.
By train needs proper information on getting tickets if your journey starts in Stratford. Phone Vline and find out - I expect that you can either buy your ticket in some local shop, or board the train without a ticket and buy it at the other end - there may also be signs in the station that explain. At the moment the article seems to suggest that you have to walk to Sale, which is clearly nonsense.
I think see and do could be expanded. The Arts Trail needs more details - enough to walk around without picking up the tour from a cafe which is only open until 2:30PM.
What is in the Stratford Highway Park? Swallow Lagoon Nature Conservation Reserve?
WP mentions a model railway shop - is that still there?
The Medical Centre is probably better in Stay Safe than Cope, then it can be in the same para as the hospital.
I don't mind a new banner, there are plenty of possible images we could choose. That's a good suggestion in regards to population and industry, which I can work on. You can't buy your ticket in any local shop in Stratford, and you can't buy it at the other end, I've taken this train journey as recently as last month. The only way to take the train from Stratford is to get the ticket from a ticket outlet before your journey, of which none are in Stratford. The nearest one is in Sale at the train station. There is an option to have your ticket mailed to you, but for obvious reasons I didn't think that would be helpful for travellers.
I would ideally have liked to expand the Arts Trail listing on my last visit, but the cafe didn't actually have a tour on site. I will work on expanding that if I can, as I've never actually walked the trail itself. I've not been to either the Highway Park nor the Conservation Reserve, which are both outside the town of Stratford itself, but from what I can find they're both nature reserves, which I suppose could be interesting, but I don't think are terribly important given I hadn't heard of them before this and didn't see them in any of the tourist information I'd checked in both Stratford or on the internet. The model railway shop is there, and has a listing. --LivelyRatification (talk) 02:41, 11 May 2021 (UTC)Reply
Tried to address as many of the issues as I could @AlasdairW: as it turned out, while I haven't walked the Arts Trail in one go, I've walked most of it before, and I managed to find a map of the trail. I've added a new banner, information about population + industry, and moved the medical centre. Are there any other issues of concern? --LivelyRatification (talk) 03:43, 11 May 2021 (UTC)Reply
According to Public Transport Victoria "If you get on at an unstaffed V/Line station or roadside coach stop, you can buy a ticket from the train conductor or coach driver." However I couldn't find this on the Vline website, or details of whether the conductors took cards or cash. So I think this is best resolved by asking by email or phone. AlasdairW (talk) 21:12, 11 May 2021 (UTC)Reply
Very good article. I made a few small edits for style and such. The only question I thought of is why I'd want to know the addresses of the police station and fire brigade, since if I needed their services, I'd just call the emergency number that's presumably the same nationwide. But it's no harm to include that information. I'd love for Powers to read the article because he's so good at seeing small details I miss, but I will be happy to support this nomination whenever others agree. Ikan Kekek (talk) 02:02, 11 May 2021 (UTC)Reply
Oh, I almost forgot: I do wonder what the purpose is for having a static and a dynamic map in the article. If there were only one map, maybe there would be no need to put any thumbnails on the left, which is not so traditional on this site. Ikan Kekek (talk) 02:03, 11 May 2021 (UTC)Reply
I don't mind removing the dynamic map, personally. Just thought both might be useful for the reader, given Knob Reserve and Deep Creek Gully are outside frame. --LivelyRatification (talk) 02:51, 11 May 2021 (UTC)Reply
The dynamic map is still available from the icon in the upper right corner, or from any listing marker (do they link to different maps?). I don't know whether our readers know/understand/will find out that the dynamic map is available if it is not shown. An explicit link from the caption of the static map would work, wouldn't it? –LPfi (talk) 11:07, 11 May 2021 (UTC)Reply
The map from the icon in the upper right corner is in a different style than the ones produced using {{mapframe}}. Also, these are currently broken, with all controls missing. Nelson Ricardo (talk) 12:31, 11 May 2021 (UTC)Reply
Because there's no obvious reason for having two. I have a preference for static maps, all things being equal, but that's sort of neither here nor there. Ikan Kekek (talk) 18:44, 11 May 2021 (UTC)Reply
The dynamic map using toolforge is different from the one using {{mapframe}} completely, and I'd argue it's worse in almost every way. Let's rather introduce the same thing as we have for {{Regionlist}} (regionInteractiveMap)...? And probably let's move this branch of discussion to TP? -- andree.sk(talk) 14:56, 12 May 2021 (UTC)Reply
I am flattered, Ikan, though also a bit out of practice. Fortunately, it's a short article.
I found the description of the Arts Trail route very confusing, even with the map adjacent to the text. In particular: the description of using Raymond to get to Merrick *and* McMillan, even though McMillan doesn't intersect Raymond; the use of "opposite the Avon River" (opposite from what?); the apparent glossing-over of the McMillan discontinuity (it says you must cross Avon Park to get to McMillan, but you're already on McMillan); and the terminus of the route on Davis, which doesn't seem to intersect Princes Hwy at all (I think Dixon was meant?).
The price for "Concession" at the pool is confusing, though probably not so to an experienced Australian visitor. Where I come from, a concession is a retailer (usually selling food) inside another attraction. But it's a food stand, what does the single price get you?
The Post Office should be in Connect not Buy.
The Avon Hotel doesn't have rooms? Only food and drink?
The description of the Princes Freeway is confusing -- in what way is it classifiable as a freeway if it has houses and traffic lights?
Images (and the dynamic map and the climate graph) crowd the upper part of the article. Any way to pare those down?
I've fixed, or at least tried to, the first three issues. Yes, the Avon Hotel only has food and drink, oddly enough. There's nothing on their site about accomodation, and I've been there quite a few times and never seen anything about accomodation, and "hotel" can just as often refer to "pub" as "accomodation" in rural Gippsland. The description of the Princes Freeway seems unnecessary to me. Yes, it goes through some towns, and so it does have houses and traffic lights, but that doesn't seem particularly notable. As for images, I'm not really sure. Maybe the train image could be removed? I've sized it down a tad. Thanks so much for your feedback, BTW, I do really appreciate it. --LivelyRatification (talk) 02:41, 13 May 2021 (UTC)Reply
That thing's only notable as its the world's only freeway to have traffic lights and houses. While the US' have Interstate routes that aren't freeways, they're not call it, unlike this. SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 07:47, 13 May 2021 (UTC)Reply
I mean, this sounds like the same thing. If it has lights and houses, it has at-grade intersections, which means it's not limited-access, which means it's not a freeway, is it? Powers(talk)23:52, 13 May 2021 (UTC)Reply
No, parts of it is a freeway and when your going 110km/h, a sign out of nowhere randomly tells you to slow down to 60 and boom, still a freeway but with houses, and traffic lights. That was my experience. If Google Maps tells you it's Princes Highway, that follows a different corridor (C101) and this is Princes Freeway. SHB2000 (talk | contribs | en.wikipedia) 03:41, 16 May 2021 (UTC)Reply
Support. In my opinion this article is good enough to be at star status. If any of TT's comments still apply, obviously fixing those minor issues would make it even better, but to me it looks good enough to promote to star status, even now. --Comment by Selfie City (talk | contributions) 19:00, 12 June 2021 (UTC)Reply
The number of support votes only counts if there aren't any legitimate outstanding objections made by people who haven't yet supported. I'm too lazy to check whether all issues have been addressed, but if someone could do that and verify there aren't, then the article could be promoted early.--ThunderingTyphoons! (talk) 15:04, 15 June 2021 (UTC)Reply
Latest comment: 3 years ago8 comments4 people in discussion
Hi, all. Would like opinions on what the banner image should be, whether it's best to keep the current one, the former one, or if a new alternative should be selected. If you have any new ideas for the banner image, do suggest them below.
I don't know the place. On the face of it, the current banner is more attractive because it's more varied, but is Turkish Magic famous locally? It's so prominent in the image. Ikan Kekek (talk) 02:55, 13 May 2021 (UTC)Reply
I don't care for the banner showing the hotel roof. I prefer the one showing Turkish Magic, but as it has closed, I would suggest cropping the photo differently. Alternatively, I have made one showing the Avon River, but I don't know how representative that is. (I had another attempt, File:Stratford Victoria banner cockatoos.jpg, but the chimney isn't attractive.) AlasdairW (talk) 20:49, 13 May 2021 (UTC)Reply
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