Wikivoyage:Tourist office/Archives/2020/June

Domestic vs international destinations?

Even after the worst hit of the ongoing pandemic, international travel will be limited. Many countries might see a rise of domestic tourism. Does your country or state have any destinations that are almost only visited by domestic tourists? Or any places where only foreigners go? Asked by: Yvwv (talk) 17:22, 24 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Tourism at Germany's coasts seems to me to largely target domestic visitors and maybe a few Dutch and Polish visitors respectively. Denmark of course is highly dependent on German tourism, especially since Jutland doesn't have much else... Hobbitschuster (talk) 18:20, 24 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Are there places in Germany which mostly attract non-Germans? /Yvwv (talk) 18:41, 24 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

In Finland, there aren't really any places where just foreign visitors go, on the other hand rural Finland is mostly domestic tourism except for the places below:

Helsinki with surroundings is visited by domestic and international tourists alike. This is also true for southern Finland in general, though on a smaller scale, and mostly during the summer. Åland is also destination receiving relatively many visitors, especially with Swedish visitors for whom it's just a short trip away. For the same reason, southeast of the Helsinki-Joensuu line plus places close to Russian border crossings further north are fairly popular by Russian visitors.

Lapland used to be more OtBP and mostly a summer destination for (international and domestic) campervan voyagers and hikers during the summer and domestic ski destination during winter, but since 2000 or so its popularity has multiplied both with European and Asian visitors coming to see Santa, the Northern Lights and winter outdoors in general. --Ypsilon (talk) 19:27, 24 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Lots of British seaside resorts are only visited by British people; you'd be unlikely to meet other nationalities in places like Blackpool, Bournemouth, Porthcawl, Scarborough etc. Of all the reasons people visit the UK, going to the beach isn't likely to be one of them!

The Brighton-Eastbourne coast tends to be a significant exception, which is hugely popular for language schools, school trips, and just international tourists in general. Brighton in particular is lively even on a wet winter weekend. Then there's the famous white cliffs that draw people, plus the ease of access from both London and the Channel Tunnel + ferries. I suppose Whitby is also popular with a certain type of international literature/goth tourist.

I've never noticed foreign tourists in the Peak District or Shropshire. Though the latter is off the beaten track for most Brits too (only Mid Walians and Brummies visit in any great number), I'd have thought the Peak District would be a lot more popular since it's so close to several big cities and contains lots of good examples of moorland that English lit aficionados appreciate.

Overseas, one place that really stood out for me as mainly welcoming domestic visitors was a town called San José on the coast of Almería (province), Spain. Considering it's in the middle of the Costas, that was quite a surprise.--ThunderingTyphoons! (talk) 20:18, 24 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

In California, international tourists/tourists from other U.S. states primarily visit San Francisco and the same is likely true for Southern California. --Comment by Selfie City (talk | contributions) 20:25, 24 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Places in Stockholm where most visitors are foreign, are the Vasa Museum, the ABBA Museum, newly opened Vikingaliv, and the Nobel Museum. Many foreigners come to Stockholm to do the Millennium Tour, though few Swedish people care about it. The Olof Palme assassination scene in Norrmalm (with a simple plaque in the pavement) has attracted Swedish true-crime enthusiasts for three decades; though few foreigners care about it. The Stockholm archipelago and industrial museums around the country have rather few foreign visitors. Big-box stores and towns along the border to Norway are of course full of Norwegians. /Yvwv (talk) 20:40, 24 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Outside New York City, which is obviously one of the world's great tourist destinations, I could probably count on one hand the number of New York State locales that fit the bill. Off the top of my head, there's Niagara Falls for sure, then, I guess in descending order of how sure I am that these places see international visitors in any significant numbers (obviously excepting Canadians): Woodstock, the Baseball Hall of Fame in Cooperstown, the Thousand Islands, and maybe Watkins Glen Speedway? But I have to say I like where Yvwv seems to be going with his question. Upstate New York is, for the most part, an unknown quantity to folks from overseas, but I could fill pages and pages of text with a list of destinations that should receive crowds of visitors even though they don't. And I think this is a field where Wikivoyage is positioned to excel. The fact that we're an online-only resource means we don't need to worry about rationing the limited number of pages that can fit within a book cover; the fact that we're not-for-profit means we don't have any financial motivation to prioritize coverage of on-the-beaten-path destinations just because that's what sells. I don't share Yvwv's pessimism on the future of international travel - the market for it will be depressed in the short term, but the current state of fear among the public will eventually wane and the pent-up demand will come roaring back once the economy has recovered enough to support it - but I think coverage of destinations neglected by traditional dead-tree travel guides (and even by their online extensions - e.g. Lonely Planet may have a robust presence on the Internet, but they still employ paid writers who physically can't be everywhere at once and who have to be deployed strategically prioritizing whatever destinations their paying customers are seeking information about) is something Wikivoyage should focus diligently on going forward. -- AndreCarrotflower (talk) 01:39, 25 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

*As a Canadian, I have to say that when you describe Niagara Falls as a "New York State" tourist destination... them's fightin' words! (Grin) --76.71.5.208 03:22, 25 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

(Afterthought, still in fun: For proof that them's fightin' words, see the War of 1812.) --76.71.5.208 03:10, 29 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

76.71.5.208 - You're joking, but you're more right than wrong. One summer, I worked the front desk at a hotel in Niagara Falls, New York. I don't remember ever booking a Canadian guest (at least not one who was there for tourist reasons; I'm sure there was the occasional business traveller, conference attendee, travelling sports team, etc.), and our relatively few U.S. guests almost invariably did not have passports or enhanced licenses and left wishing they did. If you've ever been to the Falls, I'm sure you can imagine why. (The vast majority of our clientele were Europeans and Chinese on package tours.) -- AndreCarrotflower (talk) 04:26, 25 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

┌────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────┘In Louisiana, I think you could say that Acadiana is a mostly domestic tourism destination, plus maybe the odd visitor from Europe. Asians like myself were exceedingly rare, and I got a bit more attention than usual because of that.

And I remember Kanazawa in Japan was mainly visited by domestic tourists too. In fact, I found that unlike in Tokyo or Kyoto, the hotel staff were not very comfortable with English, and it was certainly helpful that I can speak some Japanese. The dog2 (talk) 06:24, 26 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Are there places in Germany which mostly attract non-Germans? - Neuschwanstein Castle comes to mind here, which to Germans seems more like kitsch but symbolises a certain German romanticism in particular to Americans and Japanese. During the tourist season, Rüdesheim and the Rhine Valley in General, Rothenburg ob der Tauber and the Hofbräuhaus in Munich may also be crowded with overseas tourists. -- 79.91.113.116 09:20, 10 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Landing fees in Saudi Arabia

Errol Musk allegedly said he would have had to pay 2000 dollars to land in Jeddah in the mid 80s during a ten day period associated with a religious festival. Does that track with the way things work at airports? Are there fee schedules that could be consulted to confirm these figures? Asked by: Geographyinitiative (talk) 02:46, 7 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Was he talking about the landing fee for an aircraft or passenger ticket cost? If the latter, he is certainly wrong. I lived in Jeddah in the early 80s & flew out to various parts of Europe several times; flight costs were generally reasonable. During the Hajj pilgrimage season there were lots of flights for pilgrims, cheap enough that thousands of people from various rather poor countries could come. For people leaving the Kingdom at that time, there were large discounts on flights because airlines did not want to fly home empty after delivering pilgrims. Pashley (talk) 04:22, 7 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

There can be oddities with landing fees. For example, discount airlines may fly to Hangzhou instead of Shanghai to save fees. It would not surprise me at all if fees were raised in Hajj season & $2000 per aircraft does not sound unreasonable. See also Talk:Philippines/Archive_2011-2016#Landing_fees?. Pashley (talk) 04:48, 7 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Salam alekum! Thanks for your helpful replies. I am indeed talking about some kind of fee associated with temporarily landing an aircraft at Jeddah during a religious holiday season. Is there a Hajj season? I originally naively thought you could do the Hajj whenever, but now that I think about it, I bet that season is associated with the faint memories I have of stampedes in Mecca. When is the Hajj season? Is there any Wikipedia page or website that addresses aircraft landing fees as a concept or at specific airports? I want to create that page for Wikipedia in the near term if it doesn't already exist. Here's the article where Errol Musk, Elon Musk's dad, allegedly talks about the 2000 dollar fee. [1] It's a classic example of a clickbait article with a deceptive title and salacious contents, so be warned. Thanks again for any further insight you can provide! btw do you all need maps of China on your wiki? I'm real good with China Taiwan Tibet HK etc maps Geographyinitiative (talk) 11:09, 7 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

There's a fair bit of detail including dates in our Hajj article. The Hajj has a specific season; there's another name for trips to the holy cities at other times. Pashley (talk) 12:18, 7 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

I responded to the maps question on your talk page, Pashley (talk) 00:07, 12 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Regarding restaurants

why does it not show restaurants in this app and other places to stay in during vacation Please help

Asked by: 41.115.111.70 09:52, 11 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Hiya. Welcome to Wikivoyage! We have thousands of restaurants and places to stay all over the world listed; please check out the 'Eat' and 'Sleep' sections of the majority of our destination articles. --ThunderingTyphoons! (talk) 09:56, 11 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Judging from the word "app," I'm wondering if you have been using our iOS app. I downloaded the app to see what it was like, and found it to be years out of date. Use the website when possible. --Comment by Selfie City (talk | contributions) 12:44, 11 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Oh dear. Do we know who publishes that app? Can it be updated? If not, can we pull it? --ThunderingTyphoons! (talk) 14:18, 11 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Wiki Triip by TRIIP PTE. LTD --Comment by Selfie City (talk | contributions) 14:55, 11 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

That's not an official Wikivoyage app, but rather a third-party reuser of our content (as permitted by Wikivoyage's licensing).

I recommend using the app Kiwix instead. It seems to be updated fairly often (more than once a year, anyway), and allows you to download Wikivoyage offline to use when you don't have internet access. —Granger (talk · contribs) 23:15, 11 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Visa-free entry into Indonesia

The indonesia airtle says that visa-free entry is only availble at specific ports of entry, but doesn't mention which. Is there a list of these somehwere, or is it available at Batam ferry terminal? Asked by: User:Dmartin969 (talk) 03:40, 15 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Did you also look at this text in Indonesia#Get in?

Due to the coronavirus outbreak, Indonesia temporarily denies entry and transit for all foreign visitors. Exceptions include Indonesian citizens and holders of Indonesian long-term pass (KITAS) or permanent residence (KITAP), diplomatic visas, flight crew, and humanitarian workers.

Does that answer your question? I should mention that I just edited the article in the hopes of avoiding confusion from anyone else during the pandemic. Ikan Kekek (talk) 04:51, 15 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@Ikan Kekek: I won't be travelling for nearly a year, by which point hopefully the restricitons will be gone. [[user:dmartin969|–DMartin]] (talk) 08:12, 15 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Hi Dmartin969! I found this page from the ministry of tourism, which lists the ports of entry: https://www.indonesia.travel/gb/en/general-information/visa-immigration . Batam Center is listed. —Granger (talk · contribs) 12:33, 15 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Good luck on the restrictions all being gone next year. I'd suggest waiting until then to check conditions and policies. Ikan Kekek (talk) 05:28, 16 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]