Talk:Space

See also: Talk:Space/Archive

Travel topic?

Template:Traveltopic was recently removed from this article. Do we now consider it a destination, and part of our geographical hierarchy? If so, Template:Usabletopic also needs to be changed. LtPowers (talk) 19:19, 16 February 2013 (UTC)

Given that extremely few people have traveled to space and those affordable space trips that Virgin Galactic and others promised were just around the corner 10-15 years ago are still unheard of, would it be a good idea to classify this article as a travel topic (which it, per the above comment, seems to have been in 2013)? I mean, most people's "space travel" is limited to destinations on Earth like Cape Canaveral, and if we have a set of attractions of a certain kind around the world we usually collect them in a topic article. Nevertheless if we decide to keep Space as a destination, would it maybe be a good idea to create a separate topic article for "Space destinations on Earth" and move most listings from Space#Get_in to that article. ϒpsilon (talk) 19:07, 7 September 2017 (UTC)

What do you all say? ϒpsilon (talk) 19:14, 21 September 2017 (UTC)

If it were part of the hierarchy, it would appear first on every set of breadcrumbs, and we'd have to add Earth to boot. It's probably a travel topic. Powers ^(talk) 19:11, 22 September 2017 (UTC)

Banner

While the current banner image is quite beautiful, I fear it's a bit misleading. The article is not about interstellar space; it's essentially limited to Earth orbit. LtPowers (talk) 12:53, 15 May 2013 (UTC)

International Space Station as hotel?

I'm pretty sure an American paid to go up to the ISS and stay a few nights... would that qualify as a hotel? --Andrewssi2 (talk) 10:44, 17 October 2013 (UTC)

No, surely not. But as a "Sleep" listing? Yes. Ikan Kekek (talk) 18:59, 17 October 2013 (UTC)

Mars map

Interactive map of Mars now available:

http://marstrek.jpl.nasa.gov/

Not sure how much there is under 'see' and 'do' yet... --Andrewssi2 (talk) 02:52, 13 July 2015 (UTC)

Mars? No way to "Get in" yet, which leaves it a joke destination (Wikivoyage:Bad jokes and other deleted nonsense/Mars) for now. At least Moon and Space have actually been done. It might be possible to "See" with a telescope, but not to actually go there. K7L (talk) 03:58, 13 July 2015 (UTC)

Wow, that is one way to take a light subject way too seriously I guess. --Andrewssi2 (talk) 04:22, 13 July 2015 (UTC)

We will get there. Eventually. Just like trains will cross North America as fast as they already did in the 1930s.... Eventually. (okay the last one is rather unfair coming from somebody who lives in a city that had a faster connection to Berlin by steam train in 1935 than it has today. And that city has half a million people in it...) And once we have the first human sleeping on mars, it absolutely becomes a legit destination. Hobbitschuster (talk) 13:34, 13 July 2015 (UTC)

Don't be silly... tiny agricultural villages like this one will never become part of the national passenger rail system. There's really no substitute for the horse. K7L (talk) 14:14, 13 July 2015 (UTC)

That reminds me of the Nicaraguan rail network, that was literally sold for scraps to please the IMF or World Bank in the early nineties (the scraps were sold as down payment for some loan or other). And yes horse is a common mode of transport even in Managua... If I had the necessary billions of dollars, I'd build a private rail system for Central America to kick the airlines' asses (flying from Managua to San Salvador can be as expensive as NYC-LAX)... Hobbitschuster (talk) 14:21, 13 July 2015 (UTC)

The small "s" at the end of America

Before this turns into an inadvertent edit war... I think America here is and should be singular, apparently this is not consensus. Who is right? And if we can't agree, how should we reformulate? Hobbitschuster (talk) 21:54, 25 October 2015 (UTC)

I agree. "North, Central and South Americas" is weird in the extreme to my ears and eyes. Ikan Kekek (talk) 22:20, 25 October 2015 (UTC)

It's weird because it's unusual, but isn't the 's' necessary grammatically? We're talking about three Americas here. Powers ^(talk) 19:19, 26 October 2015 (UTC)

No, we aren't - at least not grammatically. We are listing several items of the same kind (grammatically speaking) with one each. Let's give an example that does not involve any number of Americas... "I have a green, a yellow and a red tissue". In that case we would also not say "tissues", or am I mistaken? Anyway, maybe the phrase could be reformulated? Hobbitschuster (talk) 20:25, 26 October 2015 (UTC)

No, Powers, I don't see it as necessary at all to use "s", as this is an enumeration of 3 different geographical regions. Ikan Kekek (talk) 20:32, 26 October 2015 (UTC)

With respect, Ikan, I'm afraid your sentence is nonsensical. Why would being an enumeration of multiple regions negate the need to pluralize a noun? Isn't that precisely the type of situation in which we pluralize nouns? Hobbit, you're correct in that situation, but I read the sentence as more akin to "We have Mercy, Eastside, and Hilltop Hospitals in our city." Or "The Cancer, Heart Disease, and Emphysema Societies today announced a collaboration." Powers ^(talk) 21:12, 26 October 2015 (UTC)

(edit conflict) I agree with Ikan - it should not have an "s" since it is an abbreviated list of proper names. To use a similar example, you would either write "I am going to visit Ray, Edith and Julie Bradbury" (singular) or "I am going to visit the Bradburys" (plural). -- Ryan • (talk) • 21:17, 26 October 2015 (UTC)

Okay, I will concede, but I'm still curious as to the difference this sentence presents compared to the proper nouns I used in my examples. Powers ^(talk) 00:05, 27 October 2015 (UTC)

The "PartOfTopic" Field

I think "Activities" is shoehorning a round topic into a square hole or vice versa... Hobbitschuster (talk) 11:14, 9 July 2018 (UTC)

I agree. This is an unusual topic that kind of defies categorization, but maybe Natural attractions would be a better fit. Or Other destinations, although I think this functions more as a travel topic article than a destination article. —Granger (talk · contribs) 12:57, 9 July 2018 (UTC)

Virtual reality travel into space

Swept in from the pub

Courtesy of NASA, the future of affordable space tourism is here. (Sorry I have been AWOL lately, I'll be back soon. --ThunderingTyphoons! (talk) 19:09, 3 June 2018 (UTC))

Unmanned exploration listings

I see that some listings which I'd originally contributed to Mars (planet) or Unmanned exploration have been copy-pasted here after that article was removed. I've already removed these once and ask that you please do not add these verbatim again; the selection of venues (largely museums) and the descriptions of those venues were written in a specific way so as to emphasise just the portion of those collections which describe unmanned exploration, which is a different topic from the space tourism described in this article. As such, my description of the connection of some random museum to unmanned exploration makes no sense when dumped into this article - which has a different topic. I shall be removing these, as the original author of the text. If you think one of the same museums has content which relates to the topic of this article, create your own listings with your own descriptions in your own words explaining the connection to this topic - but don't re-use something which doesn't fit because it was intended for use somewhere else. Thank you. K7L (talk) 13:15, 12 September 2018 (UTC)

Central America and the Middle East

In the go next section, why is Central America seperate from North America and the Middle East seperate from Asia and Africa? Neither of these are considered seperate continents in any definition. Bobbbcat (talk) 01:26, 8 October 2018 (UTC)

I've adjusted it, so it now says

Once you've exhausted the Moon, there are countless opportunities for exploration and discovery down on the surface, in places such as Africa, Asia, Europe, North America, South America, Australia, Antarctica, and countless islands in between.

I've removed those and added Australia and Antarctica instead.

It doesn't matter much, though. --Comment by Selfie City (talk | contributions) 03:18, 4 December 2018 (UTC)

Regionify?

In the Get In section, there's listings for Sub-orbital space, Orbital space and Trans-orbital space. Should separate articles be created for Sub-orbital space and Orbital space (Moon covers Trans-orbital space as it's the only place we can get to in Trans-orbital space for now)? SmileKat40 (talk) 00:07, 30 March 2019 (UTC)

Would there be enough content to fill those articles? Currently this article isn't overly long, and the sections you've indicated are very short. I'd say first let's keep adding content to this article, and only split out separate articles if we need to. —Granger (talk · contribs) 15:12, 30 March 2019 (UTC)

What about the International Space Station? There should be some content there. SmileKat40 (talk) 15:18, 30 March 2019 (UTC)

It's mentioned in the "Orbital flight" section. I'm not sure if there's much more to say – Wikipedia says tourist trips to the ISS stopped in 2009 – but if you have other useful information, please do add it. —Granger (talk · contribs) 00:18, 31 March 2019 (UTC)

Yeah, SmileKat40, I noticed you added the regions. I can foresee a need for them at some point in the future, but I really don't think we're there yet, so I'd have to support reverting that edit. Ikan Kekek (talk) 01:29, 31 March 2019 (UTC)

So let's not make the regions into separate articles yet. But see how West Antarctica have a region list without articles about them? We might as well just leave the Regions list there for now. SmileKat40 (talk) 02:22, 31 March 2019 (UTC)

Why? This site is for the benefit of current-day travelers. In 20 years if there is lots of civilian space travel, we can revisit this. Ikan Kekek (talk) 03:51, 31 March 2019 (UTC)

It looks like we have to renew this discussion. I haven't changed my mind. I'm OK with tolerating the regions listed under "Earth," but everything beyond that should be removed from this page because no humans have traveled to any of them. I'd like to give CactiStaccingCrane a chance to move the rest of "Regions" to their user page, but it can't stay here. Ikan Kekek (talk) 23:18, 28 February 2022 (UTC)

Ikan Kekek, fair played. About separating the article to different sections, I would not do so because there is limited resources on these trips. CactiStaccingCrane (talk) 00:56, 1 March 2022 (UTC)

I would still keep the interplanetary stuff on the article, but I agree that there is no need to regionify right now. CactiStaccingCrane (talk) 01:00, 1 March 2022 (UTC)

What you're doing, at this point, is calling human travel to the Moon "interplanetary spacecraft." That's OK, and I have no quarrel with the current contents of the "By interplanetary spacecraft" section. But anything beyond that hasn't been done by humans yet and therefore can't be covered by a travel guide today. Thanks for working with us; I know this is a topic you're enthusiastic about, but in a travel guide, we have to keep a focus on travel that's currently feasible for non-innovators. Ikan Kekek (talk) 03:03, 1 March 2022 (UTC)

Is this really a travel topic?

Now, I know this has came up before, but it seems kind of unreasonable for space to be a travel topic since it is the region that's above 100km of altitude. And the statement made by Powers earlier states that "If Space is a travel topic, then we'll need to have Earth to boot." Well, in Spanish Wikivoyage, the Space article bypassed this problem by making this a continent. And in Chinese Wikivoyage (which I'm also active at), the Space article also bypassed this problem by breadcrumbing this to Other Destinations. So is this really a travel topic? SmileKat40 (talk) 07:15, 11 June 2019 (UTC)

Yes, it's a travel topic. Earth is the default, so I don't see the analogy for human beings. It's not a continent any more than oceans are, but neither is it an ocean. It's space, the final frontier, etc. Ikan Kekek (talk) 07:44, 11 June 2019 (UTC)

I think the breadcrumbing is debatable, but the article is structured more like a travel topic than anything else. "See", "Eat", "Sleep", etc. don't contain real listings, so it's not like a city or park article, and there are no articles breadcrumbed under it, so it's not like a region article. Someday in the future, if there's a network of space stations that are each big enough to merit their own article, it might make sense to have space as a region article, but right now I think it makes more sense as a travel topic. —Granger (talk · contribs) 09:19, 11 June 2019 (UTC)

There is the Moon which is breadcrumbed under Space. SmileKat40 (talk) 10:03, 11 June 2019 (UTC)

You're right, I forgot. It's a unique article that somewhat defies categorization. By the way, you misquoted LtPowers above - the comment you're referring to was arguing that the article should be a travel topic. —Granger (talk · contribs) 10:37, 11 June 2019 (UTC)

"Ships" in space?

I had just noticed this sentence at the end of the Understand section: "So a space suit must be worn when outside of ships and space stations." What does "ships" in this sentence mean? Spaceships, or is this a mistake? The SmileKat40! (*Meow* chat with me! | What did I do?) 06:15, 14 August 2019 (UTC)

It surely means spaceships. What else could it mean? —Granger (talk · contribs) 13:58, 14 August 2019 (UTC)

Videos about living in space

Those who are interested in this article might enjoy this series of videos from Wired about life in space: [1] [2] [3] [4]. Some of the information could possibly be used to expand this article. —Granger (talk · contribs) 07:52, 5 November 2019 (UTC)

Space hotel

NASA Names Axiom Space to Build Its Space Hotel Pashley (talk) 05:43, 10 February 2020 (UTC)

Guide status?

This article sure had improved by a lot since I stopped editing this. I don't see any omissions, there are lots of listings, there's a custom pagebanner, and it follows the Manual of Style pretty well. Is this guide status yet? SmileKat40 (talk) 10:47, 23 June 2020 (UTC)

I would say so. Welcome back, too :) --ThunderingTyphoons! (talk) 13:40, 23 June 2020 (UTC)

Support. I think the See and Do sections could use a little reorganizing and copyediting, but overall this article is in pretty good shape. --Bigpeteb (talk) 17:09, 23 June 2020 (UTC)

I had copyedited the article to make it more like a Guide. SmileKat40 (talk) 05:21, 24 June 2020 (UTC)

Seeing that there's no opposing opinion, I had changed the article to a guide. SmileKat40 (talk) 04:17, 30 June 2020 (UTC)

Space hotel?

First-Ever Luxury Space Hotel Nears Launch, "The first prototype for an orbital hotel with artificial gravity may launch as soon as 2023." Pashley (talk) 05:54, 27 June 2021 (UTC)

Should we include a discussion on where space starts?

I think it is a not-unimportant question to discuss - maybe in an infobox? I think we should at least mention the Kármán line and the (lower) definition for "astronaut wings" the U.S. military uses... Hobbitschuster (talk) 22:19, 14 August 2021 (UTC)

Split article between space and space flight sites?

As brought up in Dotm, we should consider dividing this article in two; one about the extraordinary adventure of actually visiting space, and one about the much more accessible visiting on ground-level sites related to space flight. /Yvwv (talk) 18:10, 24 August 2021 (UTC)

I created the article space flight sites from the relevant sections of this article. Possibly, we could remove those sites from here. /Yvwv (talk) 16:15, 30 August 2021 (UTC)

Issues

We've had a major expansion of this article by CactiStaccingCrane; thank you! I see a couple of issues: (1) "Space-fairing" is a misspelling. To travel is to fare, not fair. (2) Video files can't be used on Wikivoyage per Wikivoyage:Image policy#Other media and need to be removed. Ikan Kekek (talk) 04:50, 26 February 2022 (UTC)

Ikan Kekek, ok, done! Thanks for noticing me of these issues. CactiStaccingCrane (talk) 04:53, 26 February 2022 (UTC)

Sure thing! Ikan Kekek (talk) 04:56, 26 February 2022 (UTC)

To be fair, do you expect someone to print this page then go to space? That would be a major milestone for Wikivoyage for that matter... CactiStaccingCrane (talk) 05:00, 26 February 2022 (UTC)

No, I wouldn't. Ikan Kekek (talk) 10:05, 26 February 2022 (UTC)

Resources

This section is used to list less well-known resources about space tourism. Feel free to add or comment on it. CactiStaccingCrane (talk) 04:17, 5 June 2022 (UTC)

• Yusaku Maezawa's videos are really good at showing a space tourist's experiences in practice.
• Spaceports in OsmAnd (and other OpenStreetMap-based apps)
• POIs : https://industry.openmaps.space (Space tourism on Earth) Dulliman (talk) 13:01, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

A Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item is missing permission

The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item is missing permission information and may be deleted:

• New shepard launch june 19 2016.jpg

You can see the details at the file description page linked above. —Community Tech bot (talk) 23:23, 3 April 2023 (UTC)

Not visible on this page. Ikan Kekek (talk) 05:12, 4 April 2023 (UTC)

Static "map" of regions around space

I think the regions of space (LEO, MEO, GEO etc.) should be shown in a static "map" (or diagram), otherwise colour coding the regions using {{regionlist}} is unnecessary. Sbb1413 (he) (talk • contribs) 07:20, 29 January 2024 (UTC)

Agreed. A diagram (preferably to-scale, especially to convey the distance between MEOs and GEOs) would be helpful. --SHB2000 (talk | contribs | meta) 07:32, 29 January 2024 (UTC)

@SHB2000: I have added File:Space Wikivoyage schematic.svg to show different regions of space graphically. However, it is not to scale, because the Moon is extremely far away from LEO (100-2,000 km) or GEO (~36,000 km), about 400,000 km from Earth. Sbb1413 (he) (talk • contribs) 11:14, 26 August 2024 (UTC)

I think that's fine to be honest. --SHB2000 (t | c | m) 13:48, 27 August 2024 (UTC)